Curse

Zaganher Deathbane · Feb 23, 2007, 02:56 AM // 02:56

I think Anet should consider the effort v.s. reward in making quests. Ryan was pointing out that the effort needed to finish the quest wasn't worth it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thallandor

In anycase why do we care (why i do even borther to post when i dont even play this crap anymore) if you are happy doing what you are doing in GW so be it, if you are not the uninstall button isnt that hard to find is it?

Yes, there are GW players that doesn't care but his statements. But it can really affect the decision of other people who are planning to get this game. Some of these people are seeking other people's opinion and after reading ryan's gripe, they were turned off. It's bad publication for Anet's part and Anet should look into this

AceeBlueEagle · Feb 23, 2007, 03:15 AM // 03:15

The guy uses much more colorful language than I typically do. But he echos my sentiment about the DOA area in totality.

That area isn't really for me either. No fun with the gimmicks and the extended tours required there. But it doesn't taint my overall view of Guild Wars. I still enjoy playing it after 2 years. Not as much as I used to, but I still get enjoyment from the game. I'm PVE centered but don't hate on my PVP brothers. (as long as they don't hate on me)

What I would LOVE to see is another area like Sorrows... that place is still awesome even after all this time.

Doh! Just realized he was griping about RoT.... yeah it's hard. But it's fun! :P

Kakumei · Feb 23, 2007, 03:19 AM // 03:19

Okay. Guys.

The Realm of Torment is the last portion of the Nightfall storyline, containing the final three missions.

The Domain of Anguish is the uberhard Elite Mission.

The blog in the OP is complaining about the lack of decent quest rewards and difficulty in the Realm of Torment. Please stop getting them confused.

Omega X · Feb 23, 2007, 03:40 AM // 03:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thallandor

This isnt even news anymore. This issue has been talked about 2-3 weeks after Nightfall release but seems to fall on deaf ears. This topic can only be considered to be revisited at best.

In anycase why do we care (why i do even borther to post when i dont even play this crap anymore) if you are happy doing what you are doing in GW so be it, if you are not the uninstall button isnt that hard to find is it?

Wait, why are you still here if you stopped playing GW? Not attacking you, just curious.

darktyco · Feb 23, 2007, 03:44 AM // 03:44

I've only been playing GW for a few months I don't find the RoT too difficult. In fact, minus the environmental effects I like it there, I actually have to concentrate and play very carefully. For me that is fun.

That said, it would be very nice for some better quest rewards down there. 2000 exp and another inscribed secret? Give me a break...

Navaros · Feb 23, 2007, 03:45 AM // 03:45

RoT is not the least bit hard, so indeed the blog writer's skills are questionable at best.

However, he does have valid points that:

1. The quest rewards in Guild Wars are worthless and pointless.

2. Ludicrously buffing monster stats or ludicrously decreasing player stats via environmental effects does not equal "challenge".

Kuldebar Valiturus · Feb 23, 2007, 04:10 AM // 04:10

At some point making the game more exciting, challenging and fun won't be accomplished by simply adding greater numbers of mobs and extending the time it takes to complete a zone run.

ANet will need to start breaking up the linearity of their game, perhaps by making divergent and convergent paths in the story lines in new campaigns.

Challenging is great, but for many people these points in the game will just become brickwalls. Brick walls aren't fun.

If your end game is created for only 5% of your player base, than you have a problem.

mqstout · Feb 23, 2007, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Refer to this other thread discussion: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10120993
You'll find that the difficulty of GW is quickly surpassing the capabilities of what the majority of players care to have.

Mysterial · Feb 23, 2007, 04:14 AM // 04:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kakumei

You, like many others in this thread, seem to be confusing the Realm of Torment with the Domain of Anguish. An easy mistake, admittedly--why did they have to make the names literally synonymous?

You're right. My apologies. Lern 2 read and all that.

...Not that I take back my comment, of course.

wetsparks · Feb 23, 2007, 04:17 AM // 04:17

I think that guys problem is that he had some bad pugs. Ive been in the the desolation and RoT for the past week trying to beet Nightfall with my paragon and I see rangers and warriors using mending and healing breeze to try and stay alive. These people are liabilities to their teams and since I am not in a big active guild or like playing through an online game with henches, RoT is hard to get through.

Kook~NBK~ · Feb 23, 2007, 04:18 AM // 04:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_T_bot

You obviously miss the point.

I saw a guy bitching about how hard the RoT is. That is all I chose to comment on.

I understand his position as an editor of a gaming mag, and the negative publicity this creates for GW. I also understand that he sabotaged his own reputation to those of us who don't have the problems in RoT that he has, who may or may not subscribe to his magazine.

Mr_T_bot · Feb 23, 2007, 04:20 AM // 04:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kook~NBK~

I saw a guy bitching about how hard the RoT is. That is all I chose to comment on.

I understand his position as an editor of a gaming mag, and the negative publicity this creates for GW. I also understand that he sabotaged his own reputation to those of us who don't have the problems in RoT that he has, who may or may not subscribe to his magazine.

And you still miss the point entirely.

Kuldebar Valiturus · Feb 23, 2007, 04:25 AM // 04:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by mqstout

You'll find that the difficulty of GW is quickly surpassing the capabilities of what the majority of players care to have.

QFT, emphasis added.

I think this is an increasing danger with every campaign release. It also seems to be at odds with the improved Henchmen and Heroes.

A defacto "solo game" that pulls the carpet out from under the player at end game (and some missions).

Lord-UWR · Feb 23, 2007, 04:29 AM // 04:29

Listen to this carefully...As Anet has clearly stated, GW is NOT an MMO, rather an Co-operative RPG. GW actually appeals more to First Person Shooters that to MMO fans. IT IS SUPPOSE TO BE HARD. IT IS SUPPOSE TO CHALLENGE YOU TO THE LIMIT. IT IS NOT INTENDED TO BE AN ALTERNATIVE WORLD TO LIVE IN.

It really has many similarities to other MMOs that are not RPG. For God's Sake, if you like Vanguard, WoW, Everquest, Dark Age of Camelot, or any other "vast land", "alternate world" games, you are welcome to waste your money and life on it. GW rewards skills and does not require hours and hours wasted just to get from level 60 to 61.

I personally started playing PC games with Doom and Quake, and still am a Hardcore FPS elite. I have played WoW for 5.5 months, D&D online: SR for 3 months, Everquest 2 for 4.5 months, and many other games out there.

Please do not EVEN TRY to compare GW with other MMORPGs, it just does not work. The mechanics and everything about the gameplay is completely different. DON'T, JUST DON'T ... !!!

RSGashapon · Feb 23, 2007, 04:38 AM // 04:38

I don't agree that the Realm of Torment is uber-hard. Sure it has it's tough moments, but that's why it's a challenge. I got through it (on my Paragon no less) and am looking forward to getting the rest of my characters through it as well. Once RoT becomes mundane, I have DoA to look forward to.

I do agree however that the quest rewards are a pittance for what you have to go through in order to complete each quest.

Kuldebar Valiturus · Feb 23, 2007, 04:44 AM // 04:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord-UWR

Listen to this carefully...As Anet has clearly stated, GW is NOT an MMO, rather an Co-operative RPG. GW actually appeals more to First Person Shooters that to MMO fans. IT IS SUPPOSE TO BE HARD. IT IS SUPPOSE TO CHALLENGE YOU TO THE LIMIT. IT IS NOT INTENDED TO BE AN ALTERNATIVE WORLD TO LIVE IN.

Listen to this carefully, that's the sound of a marketing campaign.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lord-UWR

Please do not EVEN TRY to compare GW with other MMORPGs, it just does not work. The mechanics and everything about the gameplay is completely different. DON'T, JUST DON'T ... !!!

LOL. There are far more similarities than differences. The gameplay is not completely different, it is actually very similar.

Despite the marketing hype, a vast majority of the Guild Wars player base come from those so-called oh-so-different MMORPG's. Those players bring their own expectations of fun to the game with them.

ANet can advertise Guild Wars as the un-cola of multi-player online games but at the end of the day, it is still just sweetened sugar water.

strcpy · Feb 23, 2007, 05:08 AM // 05:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr_T_bot

Then we all go on a nice little excursion to the real world where not everyone has a dedicated guild.

In the real world, it is quite doable with heroes/hench - go re-read what I originally wrote.

The problem is that they are only as good as you are. There is no one there to pull you through, to stop you from doing something stupid, or telling you how to adjust your (and now their) builds. You, and you alone (especially with heroes) are responsible for them. Heck, DoA has been hero-wayed - if they can do it there I rather suspect they can in the RoT. I doubt I could do the DoA, I'm not that good a player, though I have cleared Sorrow's Furnace and Tombs with them.

Read the guy that posts a little below me about how to set up skill bars - pretty much bang on. If done that way most of the rest of the game can be cleared with three to four of the AI (that makes four to five total on your team). The RoT is the only place I felt I needed all seven slots for AI, and then the only party wipes I got were idiocy on my part (Pull to a safe area? Nah - just run in - I don't see anything else!!!).

I guess I too wish the rewards were greater - but then I suppose I would say the same thing about the Desolation. In fact, I tend to find the desolation more irritating due to having to switch between wurms and on foot, the more or less maze like areas (including their size), and that the enemy wurms that you can not see to avoid like to just pop up and down taking you *ages* to kill. But then, it's rewards are better than end game in the other two chapters, even better than several elite areas (tombs you may get a green if you spend an hour of time - or then you may not). In neither one are the mobs that hart to beat if you pull correctly.

So, I fall back to pretty much the same thing I said before: Good luck finding the perfect game. At least the people complaining that GW isn't a MMO have MMO's to go to, the other complaints are present in nearly every other game (this is why I rather suspect that is why after ages of ranting/raving the people are still here). If you do not like the game, go elsewhere - not a flame, I don't like traditional MMO's so I went elsewhere.

ValaOfTheFens · Feb 23, 2007, 05:10 AM // 05:10

The writer of the article probably just had a bad day. When you're having a bad day everything and everyone sucks. Also, he probably just got to RoT. When you first get into an area its natural to have a little difficulty with it. Even if you did it with other characters, different classes bring different experiences. Ibogas are a prime example. When I play my Necro I'm usually one of the first targets for Conjure Phantasm and that's really the extent of my troubles with Ibogas. My Paragon gets hit with Soothing Images AND Conjure Phantasm(which is sorta negated by her 80 armor). This Ryan fellow has to adapt or find another game to play. I didn't understand why he compared GW to MtG. His diss of MtG was totally uncalled for. *sigh* Every game forum I go to, whether it be for video or card games, no one is ever happy with what the companies produce. Its always too hard, too easy, not 1337 enough, too expensive, etc. Stop drinking the Haterade people! There are just as many things right about GW as there are things that are wrong. But who wants to hear good news?

Savio · Feb 23, 2007, 05:19 AM // 05:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ensign

That makes learning mob patrol patterns and the safe routes through zones to be more valuable than playing your character itself.

That seems to be how PvE is designed for the most part - anybody with a crap build can get through it so long as they at least know the objectives (which turn out to be "kill everything" anyway.) If you create any missions where it deviates in the slightest a la Thunderhead Keep, Eternal Grove, or Dzagonur Bastion, people panic.

The alternative would be having truly dynamic missions and explorable areas, but most PvErs would freak at change, not to mention it would require more effort on Arenanet's part.

Quote:

The point about the zones being unrewarding are spot on. By the time you're there, XP doesn't mean a thing to most players anymore. The best quest rewards are long behind you, in Vabbi, where you got gemstones for completing quests. The RoT quests are miserable things, slogging through waves of mobs under a miserable world effect for half an hour to get a few hundred gold and XP you don't care about. Yay?

The gems were only worth it because they had a high gold value. Just make the quartermasters give out interesting items - a few unique weapons, minipets, anything other than the junk you already buy from the merchant.

Suxipo · Feb 23, 2007, 06:13 AM // 06:13

the rewarding system really sucks. Most of my chars come from Tyria and they are all lvl20, why the heck do I need more XP, especially high end areas like RoT where even my Dervish got lvl20 from Vabbi? To buy skills? Each of my char has over 100 skill points unused. Dont tell me just to go buy every single skill available.

Maybe more gold or weapons/tools as reward are gonna change that.